Capitol Hill Blue Forums Political Issues The Obama Administration Stimulus package

BTW, you do realize that engineers get paid for their work -- immediately

Matters not to me, the point is that "engineer" wages are not "poor" or "middle class" wages.

The stimulus packages was supposed to help those two classes specifically - from my understanding.

Phil, my state transportation agency employs many engineers...they are on salary. Large engineering consulting firms also employ engineers who are on salary. Some of them do environmental studies, some do utility design work, some do roadway design, some do construction, inspection and so on.

Not sure what you mean.

What I mean is that even if there is no shovel in the dirt doesn't mean the stimulus bill provision for HSR is not going to employ people immediately. It will. It would be short sighted imo to only focus on paving ready projects.

Remember, the odds of getting funding for HSR after this are pretty slim, especially with the GOP opposing any bill that doesn't immediately put money into the pockets of the rich.

First, Rick, I think you are wrong about engineers not being middle class. By most definitions they definitely are. And the stimulus plan was never sold as benefiting the poor, and certainly not only the middle class.

Really?

Enjoy exactly what?

Not in anything I read.

I agree that "shovel-ready" projects may be a better use, and so agree you may have a point (is it better to employ 1000 new 100k a year engineers, or 5000 new skilled and unskilled trade workers?)


But there is another thought, specifically on the high speed rail lines.

It's pretty clear we are woefully behind Europe and Japan on high-speed rail; it saves energy, saves money, stimulates the economy, creates jobs and so on - eventually.

It's also quite clear that no private industry is likely to EVER come up with the big bucks for the preparatory engineering and legal work to deal with the many environmental and jurisdictional issues... government is responsible for those requirements, and it seems likely that government spending is the only way it will get done... and just as likely, that it will never be passed on its own. This is probably seen as the only chance to move forward on it.

I don't know if it is a good idea in every way; but, assuming that it does provide for the final push to get us caught up in this area, and that if it WILL provide all those great things 10 years from now in addition to a spending stimulus today, perhaps it is a good idea.

We will, after all, need every advantage we can get 10 years from now also.

Having said all that, as I said $8b sounds like an awful high percentage to spend, especially if it's only, or primarily, on profit margins or high-salary jobs...

Hence, my questions.


However, I think you should also consider what assumptions are implicit in "engineering studies" vs. "shovel-ready".


Let's say the $8b is spent instead, on new "shovel-ready" solar energy and biofuels factories, which will be built and run with only 5% going to skilled and unskilled trades, and 95% going to Japan or China for the steel and robot manufacturing equipment.

Which provides a greater stimulus?

I could repeat my questions from my earlier post again, but all I'd be doing is cutting and pasting any sentence that ended with a question mark. None were rhetorical, all were real questions I think ought to have the answers, and any assumptions contained within, considered.

"It only takes one letter to change NOPE to HOPE. Write that letter to your congressperson today."

Sorry, ma, I couldn't resist. I just know some PR type would love to put that on President Obama's "grassroots" 11,000,000 Internet army.:-))
Yours,
Issodhos
P.s. A community organizer mentality doesn't survive long when introduced to real Washington power politics. He is a clever fellow. He will either get the knack or send his smiley "foot-in-mouth" VP into battle while Rahm circles behind the scene looking for the proper 'knife' (figuratively, this time) to use against any recalcitrant party member. Popcorn?
Yours,
Issodhos

Hmmm.... Trickle-down.:-)
Yours,
Issodhos

Surely an economic stimulus package is primarily meant to "help" stimulate the economy?:-)
Yours in temporary befuddlement,
Issodhos