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Joined: Jun 2004
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Doug, a year ago I was in downtonw L.A. taking pictures of various streets and buildings as part of a project comparing then and now scenes. At one point I was in front of the Federal Courthouse, on the sidewalk, with my camera point AWAY from the courthouse toward the oldest part of LA. Two goons came up to me and did the same shtick.

I took two more pictures, completing my set, put the camera on my shoulder and said, "go ahead." fortnuatley they did not take me up on it.

The level of secrecy spawned during these years on everything connected with the Federal government is incredible.


Life is a banquet -- and most poor suckers are starving to death -- Auntie Mame
You are born naked and everything else is drag - RuPaul
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It's the Despair Quotient!
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Doug, I'm not trying to sound like or come off as a smartass, I just have to "say the words"...

Is this your first encounter with Der Amerikanner Gestapo?

Anyway, thank you for what is an accurate assessment of Boss Hawg's stormtroopers. From personal experience I can corroborate much the same. All I can say is "let it burn in real good, so that you remember what it feels like years from now".

And be sure and have your internal passports and other papers and effects handy for the next time because it's going to get a lot worse.
------------------------
"And how we burned in the camps later, thinking:
What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood that they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand? After all, you knew ahead of time that those bluecaps were out at night for no good purpose. And you could be sure ahead of time that you'd be cracking the skull of a cutthroat. Or what about the Black Maria sitting out there on the street with one lonely chauffeur— what if it had been driven off or its tires spiked? The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt!"

---Solzhenitsyn, THE GULAG ARCHIPELAGO


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Doug - Your story is very familiar to me. I've told a bit of my similar experience here. I will say, however, that it happened in 1999, before Bush and before the USPA. Myself and two other journalists were covering an Earth First protest on National Park land. The same NP squads you described were there, in full camo and assault weapons, accompanied by the local sheriff's dept. All journalists were carrying appropriate credentials. In short, I was physically removed from the scene - and I mean physically - while another reporter was arrested for violating a federal closure order. The third, a photographer, managed to escape to the tree line and was able to shoot the scene unencumbered. I served as a witness at the federal hearing for the other journalist. The federal judged threw it out and made a grand speech admonishing the asst. US atty for wasting his time and trampling on the constitution. That was months before the infamous "Battle of Seattle" where other journalists were more famously arrested. I knew at that point, the first amendment etc. was no longer the rule, but the exception. Now, under the USPA, there are no rules except those the federal govt. makes. As a journalist, unless you are willing to bow to status quo, you are immediately suspect and a target for immediate arrest. And think, you were only attending a festival.


sure, you can talk to god, but if you don't listen then what's the use? so, onward through the fog!
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Seems as though the "Barney Fife" Complex is worthy of being included in the DSM IV.


Turn on ANY brand of political machine - and it automatically goes to the "SPIN and LIE CYCLE" wink

Yours Truly - Gregg


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It's the Despair Quotient!
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My videographer experiences with the US Park Police date back to July 1998. Although I didn't get the USA Patriot Act quoted to me the experience was still a rough copy of Doug's and it also took place in the Blue Ridge Mountains.
Unbeknownst to many, the Park Police enjoy what is most likely the largest jurisdiction in the country. From what I always keep hearing they apparently have more power of jurisdiction than any other police force in the country simply by happenstance.
Even as a teen I remember the attitude of the US Park Police who patrolled the tiny stretch of Rock Creek Park next to my Bethesda home. Again, no Patriot Act, but I assure you they didn't need it as an excuse.
Doug's account strikes a familiar chord and I surmise that they've simply grown larger and even more abusive, but rest assured their attitude toward the public has historic roots that go way way back.
Add to that the intoxicating mix of power and privelege in the DC area and surrounding vicinity and you have a recipe for Barney Fife on steroids.
One last question, Doug...you no doubt know that well over 50 of cops really do use steroids. Did these guys look like they were on the juice?

JeffH in Occupied TX


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One continues to be amazed at the priorities of this government. FloydFest? What does the Patriot Act have to do with FloydFest? If we think this is a police state, come over to West Oakland, or Richmond or any number of areas in East Bay where law enforcement is understaffed and both the police and the public get shot down on a regular basis.

While container ships continue to disgorge thousands upon thousands of units weekly containing who knows what in Oakland and Long Beach, busting folks for license plate bolts and upside down flags seems a waste of federal resources, at best. Unless, of course, protecting the Homeland from terrorism isn't really the agenda?


O Justice! Thou are fled to brutish beasts and men have lost their reason.
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Hey Doug, Where can I see the photos? wink No wait! Don't answer that, you terrorist sympathizer, you...


A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
#23423 07/29/07 10:05 PM
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There is an abundance of scientific research that demonstrates that abominable behaviour is within the normal range of ordinary people. Leadership is the critical factor.


"It's not a lie if you believe it." -- George Costanza
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. --Bertrand Russel
Ardy #23446 07/30/07 03:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Ardy
There is an abundance of scientific research that demonstrates that abominable behaviour is within the normal range of ordinary people. Leadership is the critical factor.

I would say birth-to-death social conditioning to defer to and obey authority figures is the critical factor, with "leadership" being the pivotal factor. And in saying that, I do not forget the venality of most "leadership".;-)
Yours,
Issodhos


"When all has been said that can be said, and all has been done that can be done, there will be poetry";-) -- Issodhos
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Unfortunately, when a police force is allowed to be militarizied one ends up with ... well ... with militarized cops who tend to view themselves as being apart from and superior to the rest of us peasants. And it is certainly not new. One of the outstanding examples of over-militarization and over-reach of a federal cop force (the deadliest because they are usually the ones with the least control and longest leash) is what took place at Ruby Ridge . That is where a federal sharpshooter blew the head off of a mother while she was holding her baby and standing in the doorway of her own cabin.

Of course, Weaver was easily "othered" so it did not attract much in the way of condemnation from the general public, and certainly not from the establishment the sharpshooter served. Bummer.:-)
Yours,
Issodhos


"When all has been said that can be said, and all has been done that can be done, there will be poetry";-) -- Issodhos
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