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Joined: Mar 2012
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enthusiast
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Donald Trump's call to ban Muslim immigrants is based on a very shoddy pollPhilip Bump The Washington Post December 7, 2015 ... The Center for Security Policy is an organization run by Frank Gaffney, who is identified as an anti-Muslim extremist by the Southern Poverty Law Center. The survey Trump cites was conducted earlier this year on behalf of the organization ... Full articleI have unbridled contempt for the SPLC, however, I know nothing about the Center for Security Policy, so I can neither approve of them nor condemn them.
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 8,112 Likes: 136
veteran
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 8,112 Likes: 136 |
CEO Frank Gaffney is a well known and prominent Islamophobe
ignorance is the enemy without equality there is no liberty America can survive bad policy, but not destruction of our Democratic institutions
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191
Moderator Carpal Tunnel
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Moderator Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191 |
The Center has claimed the existence of a "Global Jihad Movement" which it alleges is a worldwide campaign at war with Western civilization to install Shariah Law as a parallel legal and political system in the United States, constituting a separate governance system for the Muslim community with respect to family law, civil society, media and political discourse, finance and homeland security. Wikipedia
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.
Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191
Moderator Carpal Tunnel
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Moderator Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191 |
Out of curiosity, Golem, do you know enough now?
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.
Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,433 Likes: 373
Member CHB-OG
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Member CHB-OG
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,433 Likes: 373 |
A Trump supporter, "Trump Wins" goes into meltdown mode on Mediate's story of S.E. Cupps' stating that Trump will never be President. See comments section - towards the middle. Trump Wins 2016 • 3 hours ago 408 DAYS To Go Lets Make America Great Again. VOTE TRUMP!!!!! It only gets better after that post. 
Contrarian, extraordinaire
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Gaffney is an extremist and whacko (a very dangerous combination). Some facts: In the statement outlining his proposal, Trump notes two bits of data. Here's a direct quote:
According to Pew Research, among others, there is great hatred towards Americans by large segments of the Muslim population. Most recently, a poll from the Center for Security Policy released data showing "25% of those polled agreed that violence against Americans here in the United States is justified as a part of the global jihad" and 51% of those polled "agreed that Muslims in America should have the choice of being governed according to Shariah."
We'll start with the Pew data. Trump doesn't link to it, so it's not clear what exactly he's looking at. The polling firm has found that Muslims across the globe are overwhelmingly opposed to the Islamic State and in 2007 that Muslims were much less likely to view suicide bombings as justified than five years prior. Pew also found a partisan split in which Republican Americans were far more likely to hold negative views of Muslims than Democrats. In 2011, they learned that U.S. Muslims almost never consider suicide bombings to be justified. And as far as the survey by The Center for Security Policy: 1. This was an online survey of 600 people. The only available information about how the poll was conducted indicates that it was conducted online; Georgetown University's Bridge Initiative has reported that it was conducted using an opt-in Internet survey. That makes it less reliable as a national bellwether than more traditional polling methods where all members of a population have a chance of being selected.
2. The questions asked were agree/disagree, which can favor an "agree" response. Our pollster Scott Clement points to research suggesting that people answering poll questions are more likely to agree than disagree with a provided statement. The key questions — on a) having a choice of being governed by Sharia and b) whether violence against America is justified — were asked in that agree/disagree format, leading more people to say they agree than might be accurate.
3. Many U.S. Muslims are first generation immigrants, who may speak English as a second language. According to Pew, 63 percent of U.S. Muslims were born in another country, suggesting that their ability to read and write English may be limited. In which case a nuanced survey question may be more difficult to navigate.
4. The organization conducting the survey matters. There is no question that the results of the survey — which would certainly bear retesting if accurate — were influenced by the organization that paid for it. The Center for Security Policy likely sought poll numbers showing that a significant number of Muslims were supportive of violence against the United States, and the center got what it paid for.
And now, the ace in the hole:
5. That survey is of U.S. Muslims. Meaning that even this already questionable survey has absolutely no relationship to the people from overseas that Trump hopes to restrict.
There is, in fact, no reliable evidence that a large percentage of Muslims in the United States — or, for that matter, Muslims hoping to travel to the United States — support doing harm to the country or plan to commit acts of violence. Trump has learned over the course of the past few months that railing against Mexican immigrants and Muslim migrants pays political dividends. He, like Gaffney, is happy to seize on questionable numbers to make his point. Washington Post Conclusion: more extremist right-wing bullshyte.
Last edited by Ezekiel; 12/09/15 01:39 PM.
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them." Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month." Dostoevsky
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 12,005 Likes: 133
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 12,005 Likes: 133 |
I think Trump might be related to Kim Jong-Un... Trump's hugely extraordinary health
You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete. R. Buckminster Fuller
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,245 Likes: 33
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,245 Likes: 33 |
Could be. I read where he had 5 holes in one at Trump National Doral, the first time he ever played there.
The man is incredible. Amazing, stupendous and all of the superlatives he continually spouts. How does he do it?
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
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OP
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388 |
There is a family resemblance 
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them." Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month." Dostoevsky
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
old hand
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OP
old hand
Joined: Aug 2005
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Jones says, “Sandy Hook is a synthetic, completely fake, with actors, in my view manufactured. I couldn’t believe it at first. I knew they had actors there, clearly, but I thought they killed some real kids.”
On the morning of Dec. 2, Jones hosted an extended, live interview with Republican presidential front-runner Donald Trump. After about 30 minutes of mutual compliments, and Jones telling Trump that “about 90 percent” of his listeners support him, the presidential candidate wrapped things up by telling Jones, “Your reputation is amazing.”
That same day, after that interview, 14 people were killed and 21 others were injured in the mass shooting in San Bernardino, Calif. Within hours of that news breaking, Jones and his website — predictably — were hosting discussions of how San Bernardino, like Newtown, like the Boston Marathon bombing, and of course like 9/11, was a hoax. Either it didn’t happen, or if it did, it was perpetuated by the government to bring about . . . who knows, gun control, maybe? Mind control? Something about aliens? Concentration camps? Rachel Maddow
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them." Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month." Dostoevsky
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