Capitol Hill Blue Forums Political Issues Politics In General The "Right" kind or parents.

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My point was about Conservative opinions. And my point has been proven by the fact that every single Conservative who has posted here has declared him/her-self to be in favor of keeping the child away from her biological father and out of Fidel's Cuba. The exact position the Cuban-American community in Florida demands. The motivation in pandering to this voting block, running up to the 2008 elections is obvious. This position is against generally accepted US case law that awards custody to the biological parent. As was cited in erinys' post above.

That was my "proof", and you and every other Conservative have demonstrated it.

Well, since Philadelphia Steve's self evident truths (for those who have long term memories and basic reasoning skills) remain in doubt due to lack of specific citations of facts already in evidence, I shall assist by providing the documentation of his plainly obvious truth - that manipulation of the Cuban exiles' hatred of all things Fidel is blatantly political and entirely disingenuous.
It is also not unique, as they do the same pandering to others like the gay-bashing crisco-fascistic televangelized mega-zombies, or the rich Social Security recipients who simultaneously elbow poor people out of the way while sucking the governments teats two at a time... or my favorite group, the super patriots who run screaming away from recruiting offices and pile up deferments or jump line for plum non-combat military assignments.

Exhibit One

Excuse me? Am I a Conservative now?

Could you kindly identify the other "Conservatives" who have posted here who have expressed the opinion that the child should be kept out of Fidel's Cuba? I mean, by quoting the comment that led you to believe that was their opinion.

Still laughing over that "Conservative" label being applied to me. Can't wait to share that with my other "Conservative" friends, Philly Steve.

My assertion was that Liberals and Independents would come down on either side of this issue, depending on their view of the best interests of the girl of legal precedance was.

However ALL Conservatives would come down on keeping the girl out of Fidel's Cuba in order to preserve the Cuban-American vote in Florida for the 2008 elections.

That is what I predicted, and that is what has happened.

Oh really? So you conclude that I am a Conservative based on the fact that I favor the foster parents over the biological father, and you simply assume that my reason for doing so is to "keep the girl out of Fidel's Cuba in order to preserve the Cuban-American vote in Florida for the 2008 elections"? Am I reading you right?

That is laughable, Philly Steve.

Furthermore, you haven't proved a blessed thing. You claimed that every single Conservative who has posted here has declared him/her-self to be in favor of keeping the child away from her biological father and out of Fidel's Cuba, yet you cannot substantiate that claim with a single quotation from a single Conservative who has posted here.

Laughable, man. Thanks to you, the Hack Gap grows ever narrower.

That is an absolutely incorrect inference from my assertion.

The way conclusion by inference works is this:

If "A" implies "B", that does not automatically connote the converse (that "B" implies "A").

I stated that "If one is a Conservative" ("A"), THEN one will automatically "Take whatever position is necessary to please the Cuban-American vote in Florida in the run up to the 2008 presidential election" ("B").

However.

If one has concluded that the girl should stay in Florida, that does not automatically imply the converse (that one is a Conservative).

In a more simplified phrasing: All humans are primates. However that does not automatically mean that all primates are human. some are Lemurs, some are Bonobos, ...

If all I knew was that you believed that the girl should stay in the United States, I would be unable to predict your political persuasion. I would have an indeterminate (ambigious) set of information.

However, if you were to first tell me that you were a Conservative, then I would be able to predict that you would believe the girl should stay in the United States. Because that is what would please the Cuban-American vote running up to the 2008 presidential elections.

In order to draw the conclusion you inferred from my statements, I would have had to say, "A person will believe that the girl should stay in the United States IF AND ONLY IF he/she is a Conservative". I never said that.

These are the rules of logic and inference. You can obtain them in most bookstores in the section on Mathematics.

You can also see this kind of logic used in those puzzles that take the form of "John lives in the red house, Mary's brother is twelve, .... Which child has the green bicycle?" sort.

Don't feel bad. This kind of confusion takes place all the time in the media. In the case of FoxNews it is because they want to deceive their audience. In the case of the rest of the media, they cannot fit this kind of reasoning into an eight second sond bite between commercials.

Senator Hatrack (Conservative)
A father gives custody of his daughter to his wife. The wife and daughter move to a different country. The mother becomes unable to raise her daughter and has her daughter put in a foster home. The child is placed with foster parents. After all this has happened the father decides he wants his daughter back. Now the courts have to decide where the child should live. This should have been determined by both the mother and father when the mother decided she was unable to raise her daughter.
(siding against the father. We can safely predict where SH will explicitly come down the next time SH posts)

Ron G (Conservative)
Personally, I think/believe the boy is where he should be: With a family that cares for him and can provide for him. I hope that the judge will find for the adoptive parents. I think/believe that the father's sudden and belated concern for the child he previously showed so little interest in is a bit of machismo bullshit. I hope the judge will tell him to pay attention to the child he already has in Cuba and let the love-child he had heretofore emotionally abandoned find stability and happiness in his new home.



Please provide the counter example (an avowedly Conservative poster who declares she should go back to live with her father in Cuba.

Misleading. I don't believe you can find me saying that the child should be kept out of Cuba; only that the child should be kept where she is for what I believe is her best interests.

Child stays w/adoptive parents is not equivalent to saying that the child must be kept out of Cuba.

If it were a situation where the child was to be removed from the presumptive adoptees, was not to be returned to his mother, but to be placed in foster care, then I would be for returning the child to her father post haste.

If/when I say it is about actually keeping the girl - or anyone else - out of Cuba, then I'll make it so plain that not even you will be able to confuse yourself on the matter.

Please explain how keeping her with a Cuban-American family in Florida is different from NOT allowing her to return to her father in Cuba.


No, you wouldn't. You would shift to the next "option", whatever it was, that also had the effect of not allowing her to return to her father in Cuba. In fact you would run thorugh every option in the world, including Newt Gingrich's "Orphanages" before you, or any Conservative, would endorse an option, returning her to her father in Cuba, that would outrage the Cuban-American vote prior to the 2008 presidential elections.

Not to worry, I was not in the least offended. Amused, but not offended. Would you mind sharing with all us reg'lar Ranters how you did conclude that the most ardent local supporter of Dennis Kucinich for President came to be a conservative in your mind?