Capitol Hill Blue Forums Political Issues The Legal Forum Let's check in on the cattle abusers, deadbeat grazers, wildlife squatter Bundys

That said, as citizens, we agree to follow accepted conventions on those said rights and their limitations for the sake of civility, unity, harmony and cooperation.
No flag tells me that I have the right to breathe free but I agree to observe accepted civic ideals in daily life as I go about in the pursuit of happiness.

Where did reference to the flag come from?

The main difference between those earlier civil protests and the western farmers, is that the former wanted new rights, the latter want their old rights back.
If you live in a city, big or small doesn't matter, you will most likely be totally unaware of the restrictions placed on farmers, landowners and the likes the last couple of decades. Those restrictions on how to use private land impairs the owners ability to use and produce after their own fancy. It also lowers the value on property and outright government confiscation, persecution and coercion to give up private land, has been showed on numerous occasions.

I agree that fighting over federal land is not the best place to make a stand. But sometimes you don't get to choose where to state your point. Not when enough is enough.
The guns are just part of everyday attire for some of them. Just like earrings, stiletto high heels or Gucci bags are for others.
As government officials or just anyone who approaches people of opposing views, you have to adjust your metod to the situation. Blunt force can not be the only tool in the toolbox.

What "old rights"?

This is not about private land or new "restrictions".

Paying one's grazing fees would have been Bundy's best tool. Interfering with officials in the course of enforcing the law by blunt force and the brandishing of semi-automatic "earrings" is a tool that comes with warning about a potential prison sentence.

The whole "majority of one" thing is a fun little ideology, but it doesn't overrule the laws of the real majority.

Old rights???? ..... like in the Constitution? or the figment of a sovereign citizens imagination? I still have all the rights guaranteed by the Constitution. What country do you live in????

"restrictions placed on farmers, landowners" .... what restrictions?

Indeed.

For example, all the property rights confiscated, squandered, inhibited, outlawed, altered, outflanked, etc. by the rules imposed by the agencies like EPA, BLM and all the other invective three letter oppressor praetorians. Most of them with reference to biodiversity, endangered species, conservation, WATER! and everything else they can think up throwing at you!
I told you city folks, you wouldn't understand. Thus far you have proved me right!

now that you think you know what you are talking about, i need some clarification to proceed (BTW I am more than aware of what you were going to type .... I just had to get it on the record first)

all the property rights confiscated
all the property rights squandered
all the property rights inhibited
all the property rights outlawed
all the property rights altered
all the property rights outflanked

start at the top and show how property rights have been confiscated, squandered, inhibited, outlawed, altered, outflanked .... I do not know what you mean until you clarify and please be very specific .... no sovereign citizen hand waving .... just the facts ... real facts

are you against preserving the environment????

You mean that thingy in the Constitution called eminent domain? I thought you loved the Constitution.

Damn that Constitution and its eminent domain.

Of course! Most climate-deniers are.

I can sympathize: I own a 10 acre avocado grove and in the course of avocado farming, we have to dig ditches, dig holes for trees, install irrigation lines, etc. If we followed the law strictly, we would have to file a new storm water runoff plan with the local building department every time we dig a hole!

I can't imagine all the agencies you have to go through to actually plow a field!