|
0 members (),
6
guests, and
0
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Forums59
Topics17,128
Posts314,540
Members6,305
| |
Most Online294
Dec 6th, 2017
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 323
newbie
|
newbie
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 323 |
I tried to get the protocol with evidence, but they wanted 99 bucks. The index named some photos. Without the protocol I could not read what they were supposed to show.
It was a very long index.
Yes double jeopardy is fairly unique. On the other hand pacta sunt servanda is a very often referred to concept. The state is expected to keep their part of a deal.
Cowardly men always plot to label Freedom as anarchy!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193
newbie
|
|
newbie
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193 |
I'm still very sceptic about the poaching. If they did remove the poached deer, where did they hide it? As in where is the evidence? The reports I have read indicate that the hunting party did not track or recover the wounded animals for the meat. I have not combed the evidence list and I have yet to find a site where I can actually review the actual photographs and associated documents. There is no doubt either documentary or photographic evidence exists. They have the names and testimony of the hunters. There was also a charge of, among other dropped charges, falsifying a hunting permit which was dropped during jury deliberation. Looked at from the opposite side, if a private citizen accepts a refund from the IRS, signs the appropriate documents and then later discovers he should have gotten twice the money in refund, do you honestly think they will say OK and pay up? Yes indeed. It's called an amended return and it happens frequently.
Last edited by Bored Member; 05/18/16 09:10 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,430 Likes: 373
Member CHB-OG
|
|
OP
Member CHB-OG
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,430 Likes: 373 |
Yes double jeopardy is fairly unique. Unique?!? Double jeopardy is unconstitutional. I thought that you read, and liked, the Constitution? 
Contrarian, extraordinaire
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,430 Likes: 373
Member CHB-OG
|
|
OP
Member CHB-OG
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,430 Likes: 373 |
Yes indeed. It's called an amended return and it happens frequently. Not if you're a SovCit that discounts this government's laws and authority.
Contrarian, extraordinaire
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193
newbie
|
|
newbie
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193 |
As a point of clarification, the Hammonds' fires had nothing to do with the game refuge, or the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, which manages it.
The Bureau of Land Management manages other lands.
The "protesters" occupied the wrong property, if they wanted to pick a bone with the BLM. The Hardie fire in 2001 during an illegal hunting expedition occurred on BLM land. The 2006 Kumbo Butte fire was started adjacent to the Malhuer Preserve on federal land. Perhaps FWS mgmt. I'm not clear yet. The confrontations and some witnesses were Federal agents. The Hammonds have been yanking the chains of the Feds for a long time. They got much less than they deserve. CORRECTION: The jury also convicted Steven Hammond of using fire to destroy federal property regarding a 2006 arson known as the Krumbo Butte Fire located in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge and Steen Mountain Cooperative Management and Protection Area. An August lightning storm started numerous fires and a burn ban was in effect while BLM firefighters fought those fires. Despite the ban, without permission or notification to BLM, Steven Hammond started several “back fires” in an attempt save the ranch’s winter feed. The fires burned onto public land and were seen by BLM firefighters camped nearby. The firefighters took steps to ensure their safety and reported the arsons.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193
newbie
|
|
newbie
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193 |
Here's some supporting information. At trial, jurors heard from a hunting guide, a hunter and the hunter's father, who saw the Hammonds illegally, slaughter a herd of deer on public land. At least seven deer were shot with others limping or running from the scene. Less than two hours later, the hunting guide and the hunter and his father, were forced to abandon their campsite because a fire was burning in the area where the deer had been shot. The hunting guide's testimony and photographs established fires were burning hours before Steven Hammond called the BLM and said he was going to do a burn of invasive species in the area. More here.This sounds like slaughtering, not hunting.
Last edited by Bored Member; 05/18/16 09:28 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193
newbie
|
|
newbie
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 193 |
Yes double jeopardy is fairly unique. Unique?!? Double jeopardy is unconstitutional. I thought that you read, and liked, the Constitution? He's mincing words again. I'm sure he means sentence modification.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 323
newbie
|
|
newbie
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 323 |
Yes double jeopardy is fairly unique. Unique?!? Double jeopardy is unconstitutional. I thought that you read, and liked, the Constitution? I was merely agreeing with NW_P. Go pick on him if your'e having trouble with the double jeopardy! 
Cowardly men always plot to label Freedom as anarchy!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 323
newbie
|
|
newbie
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 323 |
And now for the Triple Lutz of fallacious argumentation: non-sequitur, ad hominem, and a syllogistic fallacy all in one go! This liberal affection for the state (statism) is very disturbing for the future of the nation. What does this have to do with the thread? Nada. What is its premise? "Liberalism is inherently bad." What is the logical structure? Your guess is as good as mine. I'm sure you understand I was making a general remark in summation of this thread. What the disturbing statism will cause this nation you will soon be aware.
Cowardly men always plot to label Freedom as anarchy!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191
Moderator Carpal Tunnel
|
|
Moderator Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191 |
Some clarification is in order, I think. I said that"double jeopardy" is a unique concept. I should have said that "protection against double jeopardy" is unique to our common law (shared with England). I have since learned, however, that the concept has spread throughout the European Union, and even further in modern times, giving weight to bigswede's assertion. However, I also note that In many European countries, the prosecution may appeal an acquittal to a higher court (similar to the provisions of Canadian law); this is not counted as double jeopardy, but as a continuation of the same trial. This is allowed by the European Convention on Human Rights (note the word finally in the above quotation). Wikipedia. On a different point, I was mistaken, but correct for a different reason. When the Hammonds were poaching the deer, I assumed they were hunting them. I was wrong. Apparently their only goal was to kill them, and that they didn't do well, as the testimony indicated some of the deer ran off, wounded, and were not tracked. Not only does this violate every tenet of ethical "hunting", it would also have made the forensic analysis bigswede desired impossible. In the 139 acres involved in that fire, the deer could have been scattered across miles of terrain. Seriously wounded animals seldom run more than a quarter mile before lying down. Once they have bedded, blood pumping through the muscles during flight returns to injured organs, promoting blood loss and death. However, if jumped before significantly weakened, game may run for miles before bedding again. .
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.
Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
|
|
|
|
|
