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Dec 6th, 2017
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388 |
We'll see. I was pretty happy with Bill's administration while it was happening. I made my first million dollars in the stock market during that 8 years. I would not mind 8 more years of prosperity. Ah! now I understand.
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them."
Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month."
Dostoevsky
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 12,129 Likes: 257
Pooh-Bah
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Pooh-Bah
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 12,129 Likes: 257 |
Yes, I have successfully reached retirement after a long life of work, and I always lived frugally and invested at least 15% of my earnings. I did everything the most responsible financial planners suggested and I am not in the least little bit ashamed of all that.
From the time of Eisenhower to present I have always been a Moderate Democrat, and I think I will probably be one until I die. The overarching motive in my life has been inclusion: I want everybody to get to play, to enjoy success, to find love, etc. I know they won't all make the right choices, because some people are stupid, some are selfish, some are gullible. But everybody should have a chance.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388 |
I know they won't all make the right choices, because some people are stupid, some are selfish, some are gullible. But everybody should have a chance. And that chance will come from what? Wishful thinking? Closing one's eyes to reality and seeing only what one wants to see? Somehow, I think not.
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them."
Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month."
Dostoevsky
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191
Moderator Carpal Tunnel
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Moderator Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191 |
Zeke, you are suffering from "zealot" syndrome, attacking your allies because they are not "pure" enough. I get it. You're impatient (aren't we all), and the country has gone the wrong way for a number of decades, so the frustration level is extremely high. There are urgent issues that need addressing and little evidence they are being addressed, but the overwhelming evidence is that they are more likely to be addressed by Democrats than any other party, period. Most of us play to probabilities because that is how the real world works.
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.
Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388 |
Zeke, you are suffering from "zealot" syndrome, attacking your allies because they are not "pure" enough. I get it. You're impatient (aren't we all), and the country has gone the wrong way for a number of decades, so the frustration level is extremely high. There are urgent issues that need addressing and little evidence they are being addressed, but the overwhelming evidence is that they are more likely to be addressed by Democrats than any other party, period. Most of us play to probabilities because that is how the real world works. No, dear fellow, I am not a zealot, I am a realist. And I refuse to play donkey chasing an imaginary carrot, BTW, probabilities (I have made a successful career of using them, so my insights do have some foundation) are not what is in play. It is the refusal to push the envelope by my friends here. If there were probabilities at play, Trump (an outlier), would not have made it as far as he has. The real world is ours (humankind) to make. However, not fighting for what we believe in does not reality make. It is the easy road to a very bad end. Reality is always a lot harder than that.
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them."
Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month."
Dostoevsky
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191
Moderator Carpal Tunnel
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Moderator Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,003 Likes: 191 |
It amuses me no end to see how differently we define "realistic." I agree in the main with your goals, Zeke, but I dispute what you call a "realist's" approach. Yes, we need to reset the agenda, but there is no path from here to there that doesn't involve skipping numerous steps. As the Brexit vote demonstrated, democracy does not ensure the use of common sense.
I continue to believe that the most "realistic" approach is to elect leaders who come closest to our preferences, then put pressure on them to move in our preferred direction. That is what Bernie Sanders is attempting now, and it has worked in civil rights and many other subjects. Do you think any such reforms would come from a Republican?
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.
Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388 |
NW_P I'm sure you know by now that the point I'm trying to make goes beyond Democrat or Republican. Yes, we may be better off with a Democrat rather than a Republican, and it should be obvious to all here where I stand with respect to any of the republican candidates. I see no reason to belabor that issue. Realistic means not fooling oneself into thinking that just because the Lion is a beautiful animal (and it most certainly is) it is not a wild one. So, sticking your arm in his mouth is usually not a good idea. Hillary has defended neoliberal economics (sometimes outright and others in a veiled fashion) since she began her political career. I have seen no EVIDENCE that that has changed. So I am a realist, I don't HOPE she has changed. I am willing to wait and see. Hell, if Merle Haggard can do it, so can she.
I am merely, as you say, applying pressure. I don't believe that we can be complacent just because we are pretty sure she will win and she's not a rabid right wing lunatic. We have to keep applying pressure and reminding ourselves and our friends that it is easy to slip into apathy. So, the fly keeps humming around your head to make sure you don't forget that the only certainty is death and human stupidity.
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them."
Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month."
Dostoevsky
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388 |
And while they're at it, they should get Bill to dislodge his head from his arse. If you believe we can rise together, if you believe we've finally come to the point where we can put the awful legacy of the last eight years behind us and the seven years before that where we were practicing trickle-down economics, then you should vote for her," the former president said about his wife.
Republicans immediately seized on the comment, with the Republican National Committee arguing that the comment "is about as off message as you can get" in an email to reporters.
A Bill Clinton aide later clarified that the former President was "referring to the GOP's obstructionism and not President Obama's legacy." Clearly he DID mean Republican obstructionism (unless he's completely insane) but he should have been PLAIN about that fact. He seems to do more harm than good for Hillary. Even back in 2008 he put his foot in his mouth several times during the primaries. Maybe they should send him off on vacation until the election is over. CNN
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them."
Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month."
Dostoevsky
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,433 Likes: 373
Member CHB-OG
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Member CHB-OG
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47,433 Likes: 373 |
Contrarian, extraordinaire
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388
old hand
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old hand
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 6,388 |
I could do without the threads.  But the song is cool.
"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them."
Lenny Bruce
"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month."
Dostoevsky
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