Capitol Hill Blue Forums Political Issues Iraq & Afghanistan Bush On Iraq: "Just Be Patient"

I don't think so. He continuously refers to 1400 years, in other words he is referring to the actual birth of Islam itself and not the relatively modern revivalists, Salafis.


Extremists of all persuasions require a bogeyman as a scapegoat for all the problems they refuse to face. In this case the serendipity of 911 provided the neocons with just the right mix of justifications to implement their policies with ease i.e. scare 'em to death and you can do anything. Prior to 911 there was not much literature about AQ in the corpus of neocon writers. They primarily focused on Saddam as the bogeyman. But following 911 we find an increasing volume of alarmist literature devoted to Islamo-fascism. So now we have the constant paranoiac propaganda that they, the Islamo-fascists will get us.

The creation of this appears to be luck, however the longevity of AQ's life (this is about 1000 members of OBL's cadre .... how many soldiers/police does it take to round up that many criminals?) is as you suggest
That a case can be made for the last statement is fairly easy when one cites "national security" and "terrorists" as the administrations response for everything. Why would the greatest nation in the world be afraid of 1000 jihadists holed up in Pakistan?

Yes except the last part. Neocons never heard of Islamists prior to 911. The neocon dream operates regardless of other variables.

This was not an uncommon practice of many armies to cause to die not only the leaders but the whole enemy army. So whats your point?

I have been consistent in my answers. That you apparently don't care for them is not my fault. Perhaps this will help. When I say Islamist, like Osama bin Laden, think of the fundamentalist Christian the Rev. Fred (G*D hates fags) Phelps. But Phelps with an army not just a congregation of followers. To be Islamic is similar to extremely devout born-again Christians. Muslims are similar to your average Christian. Some are more devout than others but on the whole are just normal everyday people.

To be revivalists they have to be reviving something. What the Salafis are reviving are the violent teachings of the Prophet Muhammad, PBUH. Arabia was made an Islamic country when the Prophet Muhammad, PBUH, conquerd it.

Perhaps in your own mind, but from one post you said
and then you said
and finally

So you started off saying most of the Arab countries are following Islamism (you provided quotations from their respective constitutions to prove it) and end ed by saying well not SA as it is only Islamic. Thus the source which I cited (stating there are no countries following Islamism) is more consistent than your own argument.


But you have stated there are 100 million Islamists, those professing to following Islamism. So are there 100 million terrorists in the world?

rporter you must have driven your parents crazy. All you can do is ask why? Why is it this way? Why isn't that way? I have explained to the best of my ability what the differences are bettween, Muslims, Islamic and Islamists. As your last question showed that since you don't read my full answers but just ask another "why" question there isn't an answer I can give that will satisfy you. Therefore I'm not going to take the time to attempt to answer your eternal "why" questions. I will leave you to figure it out for yourself.

Let's not you and I start bandying terms about, rporter. When I use the term neo-con, I don't mean it to encompass any and all persons to the right of me on the political spectrum. I mean specifically the originators and followers of the Project for a New American Century. And yes, they most certainly had heard of "Islamists" prior to 9/11/2001.

Sorry you didn't recognize your full posts which I quoted.

You failed to admit your statements were inconsistent even after I showed you the evidence. You continue to make outlandish statements and when I call our statements into question you simply say I misunderstand what your saying. I can only respond to what you write and what I conclude you are trying to say based on what you write.

Did you not say all Arab countries which have the Qur'an as their constitution are following Islamism. And then did you not say when well really they are Islamic not followers of Islamism? This is simple and straightforward. If I made such an error I would be more than happy that someone noticed an inconsistency in my arguments so I may either re-evaluate my argument or fix the problem. You have done neither. You would prefer to intimate that I have the problem. The only problem I have is with what you say.


Actually it is easy. Give answers which are consistent with what you say.

If you say all governments which have the Qur'an as their constitution are followers of Islamism then it follows that SA is a follower of Islamism. But when you follow that by saying well no I mean Islamic. When I ask the question, which is it Islamic or follower of Islamism, you fail to answer. If you say one or the other you have to admit that a previous statement is incorrect. The only way out for your argument is to admit what you really mean is they are Islamic. I know it defeats your argument but at least it is consistent. Go figure out another angle for your beliefs.

Another easy way is for you to preface statements of your beliefs by saying .... I believe without any facts or evidence to support my statement the following ... Yep people have beliefs which are unsupported by anything but something inside them ... I have them you have them but I don't use them as facts for anything. I am not interested in your beliefs and certainly will not argue with you about them. If however you do an analysis of a set of facts and have an interpretation which differs from mine, I am more than interested and will discuss.

Regarding the actual topic of this thread, which is Mr. Bush's continual requests for patience: I think the national stores of patience have about run out. Mine ran out YEARS ago.

I can't think of any effort the current administration is making that warrants my "being patient" any longer, although I'm willing to hear suggestions.