Capitol Hill Blue Forums Life and Moral Issues Crime & Punishment Illegal Immigration and Appropriate Penalties

yeah i hate those damn immigrants flaunting their native country in my face. the sheer arrogance of them is astounding

They did, Schlack. Ever hear of NINA laws? (No Irish Need Apply?)

This country gets pi$$ed off about every new wave of immigrants. Then, when a new wave from a new part of the world starts, or better yet, when the old wave becomes profitable, suddenly the "immigrants go home" chant shifts to a new population.

Well, no. It seems to me somewhat akin to smoking marijuana illegally and then protesting marijuana laws. It seems, well, logical.

Me too Rick. The other 20 million or so undocumented workers who don't do any of those things . . . lesser problem eh?

Think about that for a moment Rick. If you are in Canada illegally, how would your life be better for that reason?

Let me suggest a different reason, my friend. Suppose you were a gay citizen of, say, Iran. Should you illegally take up residence in Canada simply because your life would be better off in Canada because your native country defines homosexuality as a capital offense?

Do you think anyone in Canada would turn a blind eye if there were 20 million other undocumented homosexuals in their country?

I think you mean "sympathy", Rick. Let me offer another example from our nation's recent path: Vietnam war resisters. Do you think Canadians' sympathy was misplaced in that case?

Mellow, (You’re making me work too hard - )

I’m not at all disagreeing with the right to peacefully assemble or to engage in civil disobedience.

Example:

As you know, in March of 2006 in Los Angeles there was one of the biggest public protests in its history where several hundreds of thousands of peaceful demonstrators “of all races – legal and illegal” walked through downtown streets. Of course this march was one of many across the country where people were obviously making a public statement of opposition to potential legislation that would affect so many lives in a devastating way.

There is no dispute that illegal immigrants are here for more than just a better way of life...but to survive a difficult state of poverty in their own countries. However, when people have obviously not only broken the law, but that they blatantly do it in a way that in all appearance to American citizens, they do it with complete disrespect to the laws of our country…then march together in protest as though they are victims rather than perpetrators…just won’t draw much favorable and optimistic reception by most legal residents.

So Mellow…what I’m saying is:

I'm saying… that maybe their marches might be better accepted by the citizens of the U.S. if they were marching and waving the "American Flag in mass numbers” instead of waving the flags of the country where they have citizenship.

What the American public has witnessed via the marches were DEMANDS for “justice and legal recognition” by 12 million “illegal”, undocumented immigrant workers. The American public was shocked that 12 million people, who are for all practical purposes, are engaging in a ‘criminal activity’ as defined by the laws of the land…were making ‘demands’ for the same rights of “legal” American citizens basically “By Estoppel”. People who wind up in courts across the U.S. and discover how powerful Estoppel laws are (especially when most have never even heard the term)…well, they are usually more than shocked; they are in disbelief and outraged.

I'm saying… that they might be better heard if they were demonstrating to voice their value, contributions, and even patriotism to the American way of life rather than demonstrating an air of anger and frustration because they've become a public and political object of ridicule for being in this country illegally, which is, in fact, against the laws of our states and country.

I’m saying…maybe it’s time for this country’s powers-to-be select a membership of ‘legal’ individuals across the country such as attorneys, immigrant advocates, etc., who genuinely care for their cause to represent the collective voice of the illegal immigrants in order to at least start a viable process to deal with the complex issues involved in a resolution through serious mediation of sorts at the state and federal levels. Most illegal immigrants have nobody to turn to in this country…no way to seek out legitimate advocates without the fear of deportation or worse, jail. I guess a program set up very much like the Office of Native American Affairs could be initiated.

I’m saying…maybe we need to engage other countries who have large numbers of citizens who have illegally immigrated to the U.S. to be a part of the membership of advocates in this country to play a serious role in developing solutions to the illegal immigrant problem.

As of today…we still have our heads in the sand, both sides…legal and illegal. Nothing is being resolved. Anger without positive action continues to dominate these issues. The illegal immigrants are flowing in greater numbers. Our borders along Mexico and Canada are a serious potential for crossing points for terrorist from countries who would love to see the destruction of the U.S.

We have to start somewhere. We have to draw a line in the sand. We have to take a proactive stance in resolve…TODAY and continue to work toward a viable solution for those who have worked in this country and made homes and have had families here.

We can no longer afford to do nothing. We don’t have the resources to have open borders to all who want to come to America.

Major difference. These Americans are of Irish ancestry. The Los Angeles protesters, many here illegally, protested the laws of the land while being uninvited to be on American soil.

Another difference: These Americans of Irish ancestry know they are Americans first, "Irish" second. The Los Angeles protesters do not feel the need to identify with their new citizenship and hang onto their birth one - meaning, they choose not to assimilate into American society and culture.

Post repeated from another thread:

and you can tell the difference how exactly?

your tele-diagnoistic skills must rival trent Lotts

Their army is not big enough to win the fight and this is with the presumption that legal property owner are going to give up their land without a fight