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Joined: Jun 2004
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Bionic Scribe
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Itstarted, I appreciate you providing that background.

Watching the news there was an interview of Secy. Paulson. When asked if the bailout proposal would work, he responded "it has to work." It was clear he wasn't saying there is no doubt it would work but rather that we are in deep shite if it doesn't.

Since I doubt it will work except in the short term, anyone care to chime in on what happens if 6 months from now it becomes clear this isn't working?


Life is a banquet -- and most poor suckers are starving to death -- Auntie Mame
You are born naked and everything else is drag - RuPaul
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Pooh-Bah
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Originally Posted by Phil Hoskins
Since I doubt it will work except in the short term, anyone care to chime in on what happens if 6 months from now it becomes clear this isn't working?

OK Phil, you are on record. See you in six months/

And in direct response to your question... if this does not work (which I admit is a possibility)... there is absolutely no prediction that is possible. As Iss separately posted

Quote
I think you are correct in your guess, Ardy (muddy landing not crash). To some extent it may depend on how 'divorced' the financial sector is from the economic sector. But, I also think the government will not have enough "juice" left to do this again in another few years. Of course, the problem with being in the frothy part of a collapsing bubble is that a system can quickly go into a non-linear chaotic state with little to no warning and from the mildest of nudges. Time will tell.
Yours,
Issodhos

If this does not work, we enter a chaotic state where nothing become predictable and almost anything can happen. Unfortunately a viable economy depends upon exactly the opposite environment.

But, as I have said, I think that things will work out sort of OK.... although it seems possible/likely that world confidence in our economy and currency will be irreparably damaged.


"It's not a lie if you believe it." -- George Costanza
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. --Bertrand Russel
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I sincerely hope that any bailout of these high-stakes gamblers includes the provision that the CEOs and executive leadership of any company directly benefiting from a taxpayer-funded rescue must give up any form of compensation, such as bonuses, stock options, deferred compensation, and any other rewards; and receive only their base salary for a fixed period (3-5 years?). Additionally, any "golden parachutes" would become null and void. To reward these charlatans and swindlers for their bone-headed actions will only encourage more reckless behaviors and would be a slap in the face to the citizens of the United States.


Larry
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"To the intelligent man or woman, life appears infinitely mysterious. But the stupid have an answer for every question." - Edward Abbey
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old hand
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Re: executive compensation...
Gotta share this one with you...

This AM, on one of the financial channels, host was interviewing a wise, renowned gray haired "expert"...
Conversation went something like this...

Host: "What do you think of the public's feeling that the top executives should not receive the multi million dollar pay outs and bonuses."

Guest: "That would not be a good idea. It will be necessary to pay these salaries to attract the kind of executives that will be able to handle the complex management challenges that are facing us during this recovery".

You couldn't make this up... Just imagine... paying the CEO who just ruined the company $140,000,000, to save it after the government buys all the garbage debt.

Just when you thought things couldn't get any goofier....... LOL


Life is Good!
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How did the host respond to that so-called expert? I would have sprayed my coffee all over that pompous ass's shirt. Un-freekin-believable... eek


Larry
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"To the intelligent man or woman, life appears infinitely mysterious. But the stupid have an answer for every question." - Edward Abbey
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Pooh-Bah
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Originally Posted by itstarted
Host: "What do you think of the public's feeling that the top executives should not receive the multi million dollar pay outs and bonuses."

Guest: "That would not be a good idea. It will be necessary to pay these salaries to attract the kind of executives that will be able to handle the complex management challenges that are facing us during this recovery".

It turns out that executives in every other part of the world make substantially less... and seem to perform adequatly.

I have an idea... let's out source these executive jobs to lower cost foreign labor.


"It's not a lie if you believe it." -- George Costanza
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves. --Bertrand Russel
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numan Offline OP
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So! Back in the real world, today the Dow plunged almost 400 points, the dollar was down, gold jumped more than 5% in one day and oil surged more than $20 per barrel as people sought desperately to put their money into something of real value.

A rousing vote of confidence in the bailout "plan"!

__________

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They keep tryin to put lipstick on a pig.

But I'll be dammed if the dumbed down American public is buyin into it.

I guess when you start talkin about their money, people get alot smarter alot faster.

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Carpal Tunnel
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Good editorial from Paul Krugman in today's NY Times:

Cash for Trash

Krugman simplifies the crisis into a four-step catastrophe, and argues that it must be addressed at Step 2:
Quote
1. The bursting of the housing bubble . . .

2. . . . left many financial institutions with too little capital . . .

3. . . . they haven’t been able or willing to provide the credit the economy needs.

4. . . . the “paradox of deleveraging.”

[SNIP]

And if the government is going to provide capital to financial firms, it should get what people who provide capital are entitled to — a share in ownership, so that all the gains if the rescue plan works don’t go to the people who made the mess in the first place.


Steve
Give us the wisdom to teach our children to love,
to respect and be kind to one another,
so that we may grow with peace in mind.

(Native American prayer)

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numan Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Roger Waters
I guess when you start talking about their money, people get a lot smarter a lot faster.

Very good, Roger, very good!

_____________

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