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old hand
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old hand
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I think this kinda fits in here... Basically... what will 700B mean when the need is 4+ T To put the problem into perspective, let’s just consider some base statistics.
The publicly issued debt of the Unites States was, until very recently, a massive $5.3 trillion. The total debt, including non-public IOU’s and unfunded obligations including social security and Medicare, is now a staggering $50 trillion! The total annual wealth generation, or GDP of America, is some $14 trillion.
Contrast those figures with the current debt problem ascribed to the reckless pursuit of predatory lending. Incidentally, predatory lending was made illegal in most states until overridden by President George W Bush to protect Wall Street profit opportunities.
The US mortgage holdings are some $14.8 trillion, including some $3 trillion of commercial mortgages. Local government debt is about $3 trillion. But, even these gigantic figures pale in comparison beside the $20.4 trillion of consumer and corporate debt. Therefore, the total of non-federal government debt is in the region of $38 trillion!
Of course, not all of it will default. All things being equal, possibly only a small proportion will fail, at least initially. But today, all things are not equal. We know that we are heading into a recession. This means that increasing amounts of debts will default.
The main problem is that predatory lending incurs a high default rate. So if only 10% of outstanding loans default, the government will have to raise some $4 trillion, or more than five times what Congress is being asked. It will increase the US government public debt by some 80%.
This will threaten the triple-A credit rating of US government debt. It will also crowd out corporations and entrepreneurs from crucial debt funding. Finally, it will put upward pressure on interest rates at precisely the time when lower rates are called for to avoid recession slipping into depression.
If the economy moves into a severe recession and then depression, default rates will explode. These, in turn, will cause stock markets to implode, as they did in 1929. In addition, the US dollar is likely to plummet, driving up the trade deficit in the longer term. Considering these factors, many of which the government prefers to hide, things look bad - very bad. Full Article
Life is Good!
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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All this talk of Trillions reminds me that a Trillion Dollars is a Stack of $100 Dollar bills 800 miles tall. A single bill is 5/1000ths of an inch thick. We are talking about really serious money here.
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...
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Thank you for your postings, itstarted ---- they are unfailingly helpful. When I started this thread on august 10, I had the following quote: The next shoe to drop is the stock market. Its not that complicated either; when wholesale prices on supplies and raw materials go up, but businesses can't pass along those costs because consumers are already maxed-out, then corporate profits plummet and the stock market crashes down with the force of an avalanche. The problem indicated has become enormously more serious due to the financial catastrophe. The decline of the dollar will be accelerated and deep. Both raw materials and finished goods will become ever more expensive for Americans. We won't be able to pay for them. The American Way of Life is finished ---- nada ---- toast. Foreigners own trillions of US dollars. They want to use them to buy assets before they are completely worthless. That sucking sound you hear is foreigners buying the assets of the United States and shipping them overseas ---- or leaving them here as factories and plantations for us peons to work on. What Americans have done to others will now be done to us. The Indians call that karma. __________ __________
Last edited by numan; 09/26/08 01:11 AM.
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Back in the real world today: World stocks crumble on rescue package impasse, bank stressLONDON : Global share prices crumbled Friday and investor anxiety mounted as political wrangling blocked a deal to save the US finance sector, a big US bank collapsed and a European institution showed signs of stress....
"We've got a big problem ... we need a rescue plan," Bush said in televised remarks minutes after Wall Street shares plummeted in line with Asia and Europe and as central banks again injected tens of billions of dollars to avert seizure on interbank lending markets.
After a rescue for US savings giant Washington Mutual by JP Morgan Chase in the biggest-ever US banking failure, shock waves hit European financial markets. And... Stocks mixed on bailout clashNEW YORK – Stocks have turned in a lopsided finish as investors nervously wait for more news on the government's financial bailout plan.
The Dow Jones industrials rose 126 points to the 11,149 level, lifted by big national banks like Citigroup Inc. and Bank of America Corp. Although investors are very nervous about the financial sector, they were gravitating toward companies they believe are in more secure financial positions.
Smaller banks and tech stocks led the day's selling, which came on very light volume as many investors chose to sit out the session....
Broader indicators fell. The Standard & Poor's 500 index declined 5.16, or 0.43 percent, to 1,204.02, and the technology-heavy Nasdaq composite index fell 14.42, or 0.66 percent, to 2,172.15.
Declining issues outnumbered advancers by more than 3 to 1 on the New York Stock Exchange, where volume came to 624.5 million shares....
Uncertainty over the bailout package left the dollar mixed against other major currencies. Gold prices rose.
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journeyman
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journeyman
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What we are witnessing is the end of THE DEBT STANDARD of money. As I have been stating for a few years here on CHB...the fiat monetary system has a terminal point within its life span. The underlying issue is DEBT MONEY and any society that builds its economy on such money always, without exception, ultimately fails when the debt becomes a larger burden than the economy can service.
Oh, and this so-called bailout will only hasten the end of our monetary system by simply layering more debt upon bad debt, get ready for it. Our government is simply in the business of debt swapping. It is acting in a similar manner as it does with the national debt, in order to make payments on the national debt it must re-borrow creating new debt to pay the old debt. You cannot retire old debt with new debt, it is simply impossible to do, you cannot pay a liability with a liability instrument. You see, within our DEBBT STANDARD of money, there is no way to use a debt instrument (the dollar) to pay a debt, you can only exchange one debt for another. Eventually of course, the debt consumes all economic viability and I believe that is exactly what we are seeing, at least the beginnings of it, I give us about two years before we fully see the effects of the massive debt burden throughout the economy.
"The liberties of a people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them."~Patrick Henry
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Carpal Tunnel
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Carpal Tunnel
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UH...Rep-Sed this is purely rhetorical but are you saying that I can't ever borrow enough money to get out of debt?
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...
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journeyman
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journeyman
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Yeah, that sorta sums it up....
"The liberties of a people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them."~Patrick Henry
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Occasionally, something sensible appears in the propaganda organ called the Washington Post: A World of Risk Beyond Wall StreetThe International Monetary Fund has been cautioning for months that the global economy was much weaker than governments were admitting. Bush missed a chance to use those warnings to bring international organizations and cash-rich nations together to talk about creating a global insurance fund and taking other steps to keep credit problems from metastasizing.
It is still worth trying. French President Nicolas Sarkozy has suggested that a summit of major financial powers should take place shortly after the U.S. elections. Such a gathering should begin a systematic effort to update the six-decade-old Bretton Woods institutions, which risk being swamped by the economic overhaul that Bush has undertaken on the fly.
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It's the Despair Quotient! Carpal Tunnel
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It's the Despair Quotient! Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 17,177 Likes: 254 |
Yeah, that sorta sums it up.... It doesn't just "sum it up"...that has been the plan all along, since 1913. And speaking of plans, we know that the elite will not tolerate anything that disturbs their heavenly orbit above Plantation Earth hence the reason I suggest the possibility that THIS Mother of All October Surprises has one more bonus that few have considered... This might be the end of the dollar and CASH as we know it. What better excuse to usher in electronic credit money, what better excuse to debut The Amero? (look it up, it's not a hoax) Then, with everyone shackled to the Mother of All Hamster Wheels and no way out, the American people will have no choice but to accept the new electronic money, which of course can be shut off on a whim if they don't like you, or even "temporarily frozen" due to technical errors, which of course could last for years.
"The Best of the Leon Russell Festivals" DVD deepfreezefilms.com
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 950
journeyman
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journeyman
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 950 |
Oh, make no mistake about it, I firmly believe that this is a crisis, one that is deeply embedded in the Fiat Monetary System as it rapidly approaches the end of its life span, but I also believe that these thugs, these parasitic elitists are taking full advantage of the crisis in hopes that they will come out on top of things, but they are in for a very rude awakening. The entire system they depend on for both their power and their wealth is THE DEBT STANDARD of money and that standard is coming to an end really, really fast.
The VAST MAJORITY of that "Wealth" is DEBT WEALTH based totally on a fiat monetary system that will collapse, just as every single fiat monetary system in history has done, with, I might add, the very same effects. After reading many, many works by Fabian Socialist, such as H.G.Wells 1940 work entitled The New World Order and others such as the Fabian Socialist EPC-Economic Planning Committee which, if you look at its proposals you will see that just about everyone of them were put in place in this country over the last 95 years. I honestly think the Elitist have blown their collective wad with the Fiat Monetary System. I feel that they have placed all their hopes and dreams in the system and actually thought they could buck history by controlling and maintaining such a system, one that has been shown to be the most unstable monetary systems in history.
So, I think The State, with all its power and all its debt wealth, will follow its fiat monetary system to the bone-yard. Even if they went to an electronic system or an alternative fiat system, the problems within the economy would remain the same. Just making a switch would not solve a single problem faced by the terminal point in the fiat system. I think this is it.
The Life-Blood of The State Leviathan is Fiat Money, it has allowed them to expand in their excesses and their overwhelming power, but The State Leviathan is hemorrhaging at the moment...and I say let it bleed out!
"The liberties of a people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them."~Patrick Henry
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