Capitol Hill Blue Forums We shall overcome

NW, is there any way possible that the courts will not throw this out and it will actually go in effect?

Also, if it does get defeted in the courts, will this provide enough basis to make change at the federal level? Even if gay couples can mary and have benefits in California and a few other states, they are still not entitled to the federal rights of married couples.

Yes, I am afraid there is a significant possibility that the courts will not throw out Prop 8 and that it will go into effect. The problem is that this was a popular election, and even the courts are sensitive to throwing out popularly passed provisions. While I think that the law favors throwing it out, we are all aware that courts are not particularly finicky about following the law, sometimes. My confidence, however, is that the Chief Justice of the Cal Sup Ct is a conservative, but still wrote the opinion upholding the right of gays to marry in a well-reasoned decision. I would find it surprising that the majority would change simply because of the vote.

Now, if it is defeated in court, I think it would be incumbent upon the anti-Prop 8 folks to work to get something on the ballot confirming the court's decision. Crafting it will be tricky, but I think they need to "set the standard" before the opponents do. Something along the lines of "no civil rights currently granted by law may be abrogated by less than a super majority of the electorate." That could cement the right and make it highly unlikely to be overturned by a proposition.

The state high Court had little hesitation overturning Prop 22, which was not a Constitutional amendment. In fact, that was how the right to marry got recognized. So I am more optimistic, NWP, although I recognize that the high temperature of the issue will make a threat of removing justices a real threat.

Work has already begun on a 2010 initiative to overturn Prop 8 and the strategies adopted by the No on 8 campaign are coming under heavy attack. Best of all, they are under attack from the kind of young, educated, internet-based grass roots effort that helped Obama get elected.

It is widely acknowledged that had the gay community organized and acted with as much fervor as we are post election, things probably would have been quite different. After all, we started out plus 8 in polls at the beginning.

Key to any new ballot measure will be a better on the ground campaign that reaches out to religious and minority voters. Another round of marches and demonstrations is scheduled around the nation for this Saturday, November 15. I really have not seen the gy community this active since the early days of the AIDS epidemic.

Most of all, we have to show all California voters that this is less a gay marriage issue than one of civil rights and equality. And in the process we will come even further "out of the closet."

I am very proud of our young gay activists right now.

Los Angeles Times

Interestingly, I had been perusing the SFGate site, Proposition 8 contributions, for Washington State contributors, to consider my personal actions with regard to these organizations. Not much I can do organizationally (being a federal employee), but it will influence my personal decisions.

sorry if this already has been posted; looked for it but did so quickly:
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-stein14-2008nov14,0,2377851.column

I don't think anybody's posted that, logan. Interesting idea. It reminds me of a play I read several years ago - forgive my terrible memory for titles and authors, but Martha might well remember for me - the premise of which was that one day all the African Americans disappeared from a sleepy little Southern town.

My, my, my. What a disaster ensued!

I love it.

day off work.... ok im willing to mince a little!