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Originally Posted by Ken Condon
Do you think that Trump really wants to be POTUS or- as I do-- that he’s just pulling everyones chain?

Of course I can’t get into his head but I really think he would never set foot into the oval office if he did somehow win the general election. He seems to be playing a great “reality show” game here:

The Donald as POTUS
I used to think that, but now I believe he has the delusion that being POTUS would be a cakewalk for a superman like himself.


You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.
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Quote
Trump is in front today because people are tired of our government worrying more about other people than Americans.

And what other people would these be? How much of the governments' time and resources are directed towards helping (worrying about?) other people than Americans? Or is this just something you made up.

Donald Trump is only leading the Republican Party. He is in front of a handful of losers who never had a chance of being elected. He is in front because gays, abortion, Jesus, immigration, and the odd idea that being crude and insulting is somehow better than being polite.

Donald Trump will never be elected president. I know that, you know that. As you mentioned, Tim, the primary voters are the hard core Republicans, the TEA Party faithful, the single issue voters. In the general election the moderates and the independents are going to come out to vote and the results will be much different. I very much expect our next POTUS to be Madame Clinton. Although, by the same token, I won't be the least bit disappointed if Bernie Sanders wins.




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A few points to take issue with, Ma R:
Originally Posted by Ma_Republican
Usually, people get treated exactly as they deserve to be treated.
I'm not sure where you got this notion, but it is quaint. I suppose if you are white, middle aged, male, Christian, well-educated... yeah, you don't have to worry a lot about how you are treated (deserved or not). But, if you happen to not be all of those things, well... "how you are treated" has nothing to do with your individual merits. Nor, by the way, does your economic class (especially inherited) tell anything about your "character" or "how you should be treated." Were he not super-rich, Donald Trump would deserve to be treated in a mental institution. I'm not being at all sarcastic there, either. He has serious mental issues. Maybe, though (now that I think about it), that does qualify him to be a Republican candidate...

Originally Posted by Ma_Republican
There is no right to be happy. There is no right to be respected. There is no right to have others respect your beliefs.
That, of course, would come as a real shock to the Founding Fathers. After all, the document they founded our nation on included some concepts such as "establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity" - and specified such things as "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" - seems pretty straightforward to me, but maybe I'm reading too much into it - or how about these?: "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects"; "no person shall be ... deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;" Sounds kinda like rights to me... But maybe I'm overstating the case... Or even, "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people." I don't know where you got your Civics education, but mine included some of these concepts enshrined in the very document that formed our government, not to mention the Declaration of Independence and the quaint notion that "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed" - again, seems kinda contrary to your argument.


A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
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Originally Posted by Ken Condon
...He seems to be playing a great “reality show” game here...
This is what I like about The Donald:
  • Spent $73 per vote in Iowa
  • Rents to his POTUS campaign the use of his helicopter, limos, and planes

Not much else. Hmm


Contrarian, extraordinaire


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It's the Despair Quotient!
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Originally Posted by Ken Condon
Much of Trumps support comes from former middle class workers who used to make decent wages and now are working for minimum wage. And maybe not even full time. So they are pissed. The good old days are gone and they want them back. That happened because of two things; globalization of factory work and technology. Globalization is not going away and technology will continue to replace ever more workers. Sure this will provide high paying high tech work for some, but for the masses? Very, very unlikely.

---Very very unlikely for two reasons.
One, we're unwilling to enforce fair play in any of these so called "free trade" agreements so we're forced to match crap wages that sweatshop countries pay, which is absolutely impossible for us, and two because we refuse to make higher education absolutely 100 percent accessible to ALL Americans regardless of their ability to pay, even though such an investment COULD, in due time, re-establish the United States as a high tech manufacturing powerhouse EVEN with automation of much of the assembly process.

I see NOTHING in Trump's plan of action that would change any of that despite his crowing about China and Mexico, and even if I did, whatever he is saying is a bald faced lie because his OWN manufacturing is EXCLUSIVELY from China and Mexico.


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Ezekiel Offline OP
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Originally Posted by NW Ponderer
A few points to take issue with, Ma R:
Originally Posted by Ma_Republican
Usually, people get treated exactly as they deserve to be treated.
I'm not sure where you got this notion, but it is quaint. I suppose if you are white, middle aged, male, Christian, well-educated... yeah, you don't have to worry a lot about how you are treated (deserved or not). But, if you happen to not be all of those things, well... "how you are treated" has nothing to do with your individual merits. Nor, by the way, does your economic class (especially inherited) tell anything about your "character" or "how you should be treated." Were he not super-rich, Donald Trump would deserve to be treated in a mental institution. I'm not being at all sarcastic there, either. He has serious mental issues. Maybe, though (now that I think about it), that does qualify him to be a Republican candidate...

Originally Posted by Ma_Republican
There is no right to be happy. There is no right to be respected. There is no right to have others respect your beliefs.
That, of course, would come as a real shock to the Founding Fathers. After all, the document they founded our nation on included some concepts such as "establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity" - and specified such things as "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" - seems pretty straightforward to me, but maybe I'm reading too much into it - or how about these?: "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects"; "no person shall be ... deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;" Sounds kinda like rights to me... But maybe I'm overstating the case... Or even, "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people." I don't know where you got your Civics education, but mine included some of these concepts enshrined in the very document that formed our government, not to mention the Declaration of Independence and the quaint notion that "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed" - again, seems kinda contrary to your argument.

I find it amazing that American citizens need to be reminded of these fundamental points that NWP so eloquently makes.


"The liberals can understand everything but people who don't understand them."
Lenny Bruce

"The cleverest of all, in my opinion, is the man who calls himself a fool at least once a month."
Dostoevsky



Ezekiel #284778 02/12/16 04:50 PM
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Generally speaking, while we hear a lot about the Constitution from Republicans, we don't see much understanding of it.


Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...
Greger #284780 02/12/16 05:58 PM
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for the true believers it does not mean anything ... as long as they say they are true Constitutionalists, they will believe


ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Save America - Lock Trump Up!!!!

Greger #284799 02/12/16 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Greger
Generally speaking, while we hear a lot about the Constitution from Republicans, we don't see much understanding of it.

This Mormon pseudo-historian is why the Oregon militants are so confused about the Constitution

Godd*m Cleon Skousen, again, it's like a cancer.


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Originally Posted by Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted by Greger
Generally speaking, while we hear a lot about the Constitution from Republicans, we don't see much understanding of it.

This Mormon pseudo-historian is why the Oregon militants are so confused about the Constitution

Godd*m Cleon Skousen, again, it's like a cancer.
Yup, I wrote about it yesterday too.


Contrarian, extraordinaire


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