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I like you, always associated charisma with good. But there were a lot of bad folks who were charismatic, Hitler and Mussolini come to mind. Then there was Jim Jones who's charisma lead over 900 people to take their own lives including the lives of their children. But I think these people are looking for something in these folks that the rest of us aren't.
What I noticed about Trump and the GOP before the primaries began, a lot of Republicans were attracted to him because he was a fighter. A lot of Republicans were mad at their own members of congress. Especially those in the House. Some for unknown reason which makes no sense to me, after the GOP retook the house in 2010 they expected the House to govern this nation and to stop Obama cold. When the House couldn't accomplish what they wanted, a lot of Republicans turned on them. Trump became very attractive to them, perhaps only because he came across as a fighter, someone who would take no bull, a feud creator who went after anyone and everyone who ever spoke bad about him.
One has to remember that until Trump clinched the nomination, he was winning primary after primary with but 30-35% of the Republican vote. He was winning because of the extra large field of candidates and when it became clear Trump might win the nomination, the narrowed field couldn't decide on one of them to oppose Trump.
Being a fighter was enough, Trump doesn't have a political ideology and he isn't a loyal party man. He expects loyalty from others but gives none in return. Trump is for Trump and nothing else.
To be honest, when it became clear that Trump was going to be the Republican nominee. This became clear to me right after the New Hampshire primary when Christie destroyed Rubio and none of the debaters when after the then leader, Trump. I thought, "Oh boy, the Democrats will waltz into the White House."
Then the Democrats nominate Hillary Clinton, someone as disliked by American's as a whole, all America as Trump was. I remember thinking, that was a huge mistake, although I always thought she'd win. I resigned myself to four years of Hillary only because the Republicans had nominated Trump. The warning signs were there, a big one in February of 2016 when a poll revealed 56% of all Americans wanted the Democrats to nominate someone other than Hillary. The dissatisfaction of a majority of Americans with Hillary was apparent and front and centered. Yet, totally ignored by the Democrats.
But the rest is history, a party loyalist or an avid supporter of any candidate can't ever understand how one could support someone else or the other party. That's the nature of the game.
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
Trump became very attractive to them, perhaps only because he came across as a fighter, someone who would take no bull, a feud creator who went after anyone and everyone who ever spoke bad about him.
I don't think it was because he is a 'fighter', I think it is because he is an unapologetic bigot and is unafraid to cheat to win. Trump followers desperately want to feel like they are "winning".
Originally Posted by perotista
...a party loyalist or an avid supporter of any candidate can't ever understand how one could support someone else or the other party. That's the nature of the game.
I don't think this is a matter of partisanship for the earnest Trump followers - it does seem to be a matter of strategy for many right-wing politicians, though, who are trying to do the math to stay in office.
It's not a partisan matter for me, as I have always found the man to be disgusting, even when he played at being a Democrat. This is the crux of it: I don't understand the folks who don't find him to be disgusting. I have an acquaintance (bordering on a friend) who said to me out of the blue, "Trump just makes me so goddamned proud!" (I didn't press the issue... experience has shown that it would go nowhere good)
You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete. R. Buckminster Fuller
You can call it what you want, but there was a lot of anger at the Republican house members. They gave the impression of rolling over dead when it came to Obama. Hence the anger lead to the need for a fighter.
I don't buy the bigot and racist thing either. Whites have voted Republican 54% in 2000, 58% in 2004, 55% in 2008, 59% in 2012 and 57% in 2016. Trump's 57% was right on average with the last 5 elections. It seems more a case of party ID and ideology. It's no secret that the Democrats have a problem attracting white voters while the Republicans have a problem with minorities.
I suppose you can call those who don't vote for your candidates racists and bigots. That may have something to do with it. But Whites had no problem voting for Tim Scott in South Carolina, also remember Herman Cain lead the GOP field back in 2012 for a couple of weeks. The Republicans are running John James, another black man in the Michigan senate race. I do think it's more a case of party loyalty and ideology than racist or bigotry. But it has almost always been that way. Republicans haven't won the black vote since 1928 when only blacks in the north and west voted. Democrats haven't won the white vote since 1964. Carter in 1976 came the closes of any democrat of winning the white vote since 1964 when he lost the white vote for Ford 48-52.
Look at this way, Gore, a white man received 42% of the white vote, Kerry, another white man received 41% of the white vote. Obama a black man in 2008 received 43% of the white vote. More than either of the first two white, male Democratic candidates. Obama's 43% was the highest percentage of the white vote since Bill Clinton's 44% back in 1996. Although Obama fell to 39% in 2012 among white voters. Clinton received 37% of the white vote. But in 2016 6% of whites voted third party.
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
Bigot: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices
Bigotry is not confined to racism. I see it as a term representing the inability to consider things while suspending pre-judgments, and a refusal to acknowledge facts. Not all opinions are based on facts. Obstinate refusal to consider facts is bigotry.
As in everything, there are degrees...
You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete. R. Buckminster Fuller
I have noticed that gullibility is a major factor with Trump followers, which plays into their bigotry in a big way.
As an example of how Trump (and his nefarious cabal of con men and crooks) use the gullibility of his followers is in the parable of Bannon, Kolfage, and the Great Wall Con.
Believing the constant stream of Trump lies and gaslighting is another yooge example.
You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete. R. Buckminster Fuller
If that's the case, we're all bigots in a way. I know I have a few opinions I'm not going to change, period.
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
Here is one of the better videos dealing with Trump true believers. Its funny but, if you think about it, I am not sure just how funny it really is. This is, I think, descriptive of approximately 30% of the American voting public!
Whites have voted Republican 54% in 2000, 58% in 2004, 55% in 2008, 59% in 2012 and 57% in 2016. Trump's 57% was right on average with the last 5 elections.
That would be consistent with the percentage of bigoted and racist white nationalists in America.
